timing chain

S

Silver bullet

Registered
I have a beautiful 95 Mark 8 w/ 128k mi. and the timing chain is broken. The least expensive $ I've received is $2500 and then, they are not sure it won't need more than that.
Anyone with the same experience or suggestions/ I love my Mark, but there is a limit? All else on it is very good, no rust, great tires, new brakes and rotors, wires, hoses, serp...anyone know a great mech in the chicago area that works on my Mark???
Steve
 
There are 4 timing chains, what one is broken? Timing chain failures are rare for the mark viii.
 
If it runs, especially if it runs smooth, the timing chain is NOT broken. After all, the chain turns the cams that move the valves. No valve action, no intake or exhaust. To me, it sounds like you have maybe broken a chain tensioner, and the chain is contacting sloppy chain is hitting the cover when you start it.

I would appreciate it if you would confirm how it runs to me.
 
Thanks. It starts and then the clanking starts, metal on metal, it would continue to run, but I shut it down. I took it to a Lincoln Dealer and they said it is possibly the timing chain, or guides, but just a few days before it started to clank, it would start, be very rocky until it warmed up, then smooth out after 5-7 minutes held at 1200 rpm. When I let it go down to 7-800 rpm, it would almost die. Until the final time when it did die, coudn't start for about 5 minutes, then turned it over, then the clanking metal on metal bad sound started. next day I tried to startr, it did and the metal on metal clank was still there. The lincoln dealer wouldn't fix it, "A can of worms" and I got quotes from independent mechanics for $2500 and up, as they all said, don't know what to expect when the open it up.
Any help would be appreciated.
Steve
 
As was said if it ran smooth it was unlikely a timing chain. Just a guess here but on an old car I had when the water pump went it made an awful clanking sound and the sound would get less if the RPMs were higher. There are a few people in the Chicago area on the forum, can’t say if any of them can help but make new post and in the title ask for help in the Chicago area. Not everyone may see this post.

Also take a look at the FAQ below, however it sounds like you may have something more serious: http://www.lincolnsofdistinction.org/lincolntech/faq/index.html#Maint6

What's the clattering noise I hear when I start my car? It goes away after a few seconds.

This is common on the Mark VIII, and is caused by oil leakdown, causing the secondary cam tensioners to rattle. The 'fix' from Ford costs about $1200, and requires serious disassembly of the front of the motor. While annoying, it typically will not cause damage. Installation of a pre-oiler will stop this, and some have had luck with various oils and anti-drainback filters.
 
If the car runs at all, the cam timing chain is NOT broken.

If you look at the attached pic you can see what I am talking about.
 

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I'd pull the valve cover off first. You can see the chains, and with a good flashlight, you might get a good view of them (and the tensioners) down towards the crankshaft.

You'll also get a chance to check the valve springs, which seem to be a weak spot in some 95's.
 
Well, the place I suggested in Highland Park is highly expensive.

I moved a couple of your posts to a new thread, maybe we can get a few Chicago people to get together and take a look at it with you. I don't know. I've got a lot of things to get done around the house here, so I can't commit hubby to anything, but we do have a garage and tools and air compressor.

Check with Anthraxbird, PM him, he's out of work, maybe he could use a side job? He's NW Indiana.
 
I haven't run into this myself or had anyone that I know of have it happen to them; our chain tensioners have a ratchet in them. Sometimes when say the engine has started in a long time or the oil has become very thin the oil will allow the tensioners to leak down and thus release the tension on the chains. Then when you start the engine in this condition one tensioner may pump up faster and over travel somewhat to take up the slack. When this happens the ratchet locks the over traveled tension so that the chain is now much tighter than it should be. The chain then starts chewing up the plastic guide on the chain guide. Once it chews through the plastic it has the aluminum only and then you have metal shavings in your oil besides all the slop now in the chain that will make the noise you are describing.

I have seen a few pics on the net of SOHCs doing this a lot. But have only heard of this on the DOHCs.
 
Do the early type tensioners (say, on my 93 Mark) have those ratchet mechanisms? I was told they did not. Reason I ask is because I was considering upgrading to the newer type tensioners that apparently 'fix' the timing chain 'slap' on start-up. I was under the impression that the 'fix' Ford did with tensioners was to add the ratchet thing, but I could be wrong.

If it is the case that my tensioners are a non-ratchet type and there is a problem with the ratcheting type over-tensioning chains, then I'll not bother replacing them.

I hadn't heard about that oil pressure problem until now, but I have heard of tensioners apparently over ratcheting in drag applications.

Edit: Sorry, no thread hi-jack meant, but Lonnie has raised some interesting points.
 
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Yes, all he Marks have the ratchet setup. There was two different upgrades in the early 2000s for these. The first was just the plastic tensioners but they became more of a problem than the iron ratchet type due to always leaking down. They then came up with a rubber gasket to fix this. The plastic couldn't be milled flat enough to keep a seal on the face when bolted on. I don't really know which is the best. I use the ratchet type personally.

In drag applications it happens with manual transmissions from what I've read and been told. During the hole shot the chain tightens very tight on the side without the tensioner and so the slack is excessive on the tensioner side and the plunger extends out to take it up to the point the ratchet extends another tooth and then doesn't back off when the chain is in the normal working condition.
 
Ah, ok. Thanks for the info, Lonnie - those 'upgrades' don't sound good at all, so I'll keep my original tensioners. Makes me relieved - I didn't want to delve into the timing area unless necessary! :)
 
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