The Mark's Cooling Fan Mods

[mlschultz]

Finally found out the limits of the 17" Mustang GT cooling fan that has been in The Mark since the supercharger install a couple years ago. Metro Atlanta heat wave 2010 has been in the 90's+ just about every day for a couple months now, and when I drive in stop and go traffic in these temps, the car temp gauge will move beyond half way when I have the A/C on, and will recover and go back to the normal middle of the gauge position when I turn the A/C off. On the interstate at speed, the car runs normal with the A/C on with no problem.

I had Aric look the car over, and he said everything is functioning normally. He was able to recreate the symptoms in his shop, and his dyno fan cooled the car off 22 degrees while it was running idle in the shop. He figures the dyno fan is good for 45-50mph wind. So, blame it on the weather.


The car has a Ford Racing Mustang Cobra radiator (for a manual shift car = no trans cooler tanks), a Treadstone supercharger intercooler, a huge Ford truck trans cooler, and a stock Mark VIII A/C condenser all stacked in the nose of the car.

Now driving without A/C in Atlanta in the summer is like driving without a heater in the winter in Michigan. Not gonna happen

So, Aric is going to install two Spal push style fans on the radiator directly in line with the grill opening. Each fan should be good for 440 cfm (880 total cfm). We are talking about going with a Spal 16" high output pull fan replacing the Mustang GT fan. The 16" Spal fan is good for 3300 cfm. The problem with this 16" Spal fan is it needs 45 amps to run full speed. Just need to see if the electrical system can handle the additional amps. I think a stock Mark needs 30 amps to run the fan. lol I feel like a engineer on Apollo 13

The plan is to have Aric wire everything to run through the PCM and VLCM.

Here are some pictures of what it looks like before the mods, and the fans...


16" Spal Pull Fan

7.5" Spal Push Fan

Mustang GT Fan - location of 16" Spal HO Pull Fan & Cobra Radiator

Another Pull fan view

Grill view - location of two 7.5" Spal Push Fans

Another view 7.5" Push fans & Stock Mark A/C Condenser

Treadstone Intercooler location

Another Intercooler view

Ford Truck Transmission cooler

Another view Trans Cooler

 

[driller]

I have to wonder if the VLCM can handle the additional load. You may very well require a relay setup.

 

[mlschultz]

Aric said the same thing. I asked him how he was going to wire three fans to the VLCM, and he smiled at me and said that is what I am paying him for. So, I am sure there is more to the story than what I have told.

 

[crash]

Why don't you use a mark 8 fan?

 

[mlschultz]

When Aric did all the supercharger mods, he said that the Mark VIII fan would not fit. That is why he went with a Mustang GT fan that is offset to the drivers side of the radiator.

 

[driller]

Aric said the same thing. I asked him how he was going to wire three fans to the VLCM, and he smiled at me and said that is what I am paying him for. So, I am sure there is more to the story than what I have told.

Well, I know a regular cube relay won't work. I ended up replacing my cooling fan bypass relay with a constant duty charging solenoid from a DC forklift. The 40 amp cube relay literally melted from the amperage.

I only have the Mark VIII fan but when i had to redo the relay I wanted reserve capacity for any additional fans I may require in the future. So far I have not needed any.

 

[billcu]

Sounds good Mike but I didn't know the gen2 temp gage went above half way? I thought it was just an idiot gage.

My gen 1 has been going past half way with these 90 degree temps but it's still well into the "normal" range.

 

[driller]

My gen 1 has been going past half way with these 90 degree temps but it's still well into the "normal" range.

My '93 does not like bumper to bumper traffic in the heat, even with the fan on max. The '96 has always been a cooler running car in summer heat waves. The only time it starts to get above normal is long runs at high speed.

 

[LINCOLNBOY]

A griffen rad geno did on his mark proved to lower his temps and kept it below normal range. That is one thing I'm needing badly for my mark is a trans cooler this Texas heat is a killer. I won't go another summer without it help life span on the trans also.

 

[mlschultz]

All the parts are in, and The Mark is going to Arics today for the surgery. Spal has the wiring harness on backorder, so Aric is going to make his own. From what I understand, the VLCM is going to be the trigger wire, and the fans will run off their own fuse/relay. lol I have no idea how he is going to make it all work.

I was thinking to have the two small pusher fans run as auxiliary secondary fans on a separate circuit using their own controller, relay, and sensor that run independent of the VLCM. Not sure if Aric wants to go in that direction though. He seemed to be certain that he wanted to control everything through the pcm.

I will post pic's and a video when it is done.

 

[maxmk8]

Well you aren't you doing a bit of overkill ? How hot does your car actually get?

The vette temp goes up well beyond the middle every time it gets hot and you sit in traffic. Considered normal and most ppl don't care because the cooling fan kicks up by 225F. There are no real side-effects of running a little bit warmer for a bit of time.

 

[driller]

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I wish you luck.

How are your tranny temps doing?

My new converter is definitely making more heat.

 

[mlschultz]

Well you aren't you doing a bit of overkill ? How hot does your car actually get?

The vette temp goes up well beyond the middle every time it gets hot and you sit in traffic. Considered normal and most ppl don't care because the cooling fan kicks up by 225F. There are no real side-effects of running a little bit warmer for a bit of time.

lol The whole car is overkill. The 3 fans will get me a couple hundred cfm more than what a stock single 18" Mark pull fan can do. I would be using a Mark fan, but the S/C discharge tube is in the way.

With the money I have in the motor and S/C, it is a drop in the bucket to have these fans installed to ensure the temp does not rise beyond half way on the gauge - at all, ever, under any circumstances. I would of done this years ago if I knew the car would behave like this in the 10 degree hotter days we are having this year over prior years.

Not sure how hot it actually gets, but on the gauge, the needle will go up to 3/4 before I freak out and turn the a/c off. It just continues to get hotter with the a/c on while in traffic. It recovers quickly back to half way with the a/c off in traffic.

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I wish you luck.

How are your tranny temps doing?

My new converter is definitely making more heat.

Thanks, JP. I have no idea what the trans temps are. Aric had is laptop hooked up to it to monitor everything, and did not say anything about the trans temps being out of range.

 

[crash]

Fwiw, a mark 8 fan will fit, with some modifications. I have a mark8 fan on a cobra radiator. My s/c also has an Anderson powerpipe.

 

[mlschultz]

I have a discharge tube that travels across the radiator from the top of the passenger side of the car, to the bottom of the drivers side to the inlet of the intercooler. As far as I know, there is not enough room for the 18" fan in my car.

OK Here is the update (change in plans) - Aric is going leave the Mustang fan in the car as is, triggered by the VLCM. He is not going to install the HO 16" Spal fan. The 16" Spal fan will be plan "B".

He is going to install the two 7.5" Spal fans as a stand alone dedicated system, and will use the A/C system as the trigger switch. When the A/C is turned on, the two 7.5" Spal fans will turn on and run until the A/C is turned off. My SL Mercedes has a similar set-up with two pusher fans for A/C, and a viscous clutch cooling fan, and it works very well. Remember, the Mustang fan did just fine without the A/C on.

He has to move the intercooler towards the bumper a little to fit the fans where he wants them on the condenser using spacers.

He is going to swap out the 180* thermostat in the car with a 160* t-stat.

Hopefully, these changes will do the job If not... See plan "B"

 

[mlschultz]

Here it is. The car takes much longer to warm up now. I am going to switch over to Evans coolant http://www.evanscooling.com/ for extra insurance. Hopefully this will enable me to drive The Mark with the A/C on whenever I want, regardless of how hot it is outside.

 

[driller]

Looks good Mike!

So, does Aric have quick release latches on the front bumper cover yet? :fart

 

[mlschultz]

Thanks, JP. lol I think he has it all held together with one nut.

My first time out driving the car with the new fans was to Caffeine and Octane this past Sunday morning. It is about a half hour drive from my house, and the car did not warm up completely to half way on the temp gauge. I noticed a fine layer soot on the bumper when I got out of the car, so I think Aric might need to look at the tune again.

When the Evans coolant goes in, I read that you need to bump the thermostat up to around 230*, and re-program the fan on/off temps in the pcm. Hope this stuff works...

 

[mlschultz]

Time to change out the old antifreeze, and go with Evans waterless coolant! lol The UPS guy was not happy delivering this package. All 10 gallons in one box. I ordered 8 gallons of coolant, and 2 gallons of prep. I got a better deal ordering 2 - 4 gallon packs of coolant. It came to $331.52 shipped for everything.

I am going to have Aric change the coolant out, and do yet another dyno tune on The Mark to data log, recalibrate fan on/off, and see if he can throw some more timing at it since this coolant should keep the water jackets at a cooler temp and help prevent detonation. At least that is what the people at Evans say.

 

[driller]

I am going to have Aric change the coolant out, and do yet another dyno tune on The Mark to data log, recalibrate fan on/off, and see if he can throw some more timing at it since this coolant should keep the water jackets at a cooler temp and help prevent detonation. At least that is what the people at Evans say.

I will be anxiously watching for the results!