03 supercharger parts on 95 4.6

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AbrahamLincoln

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I was doing some reading on wikipedia... it says the 4.6 DOHC is the same engine thats in a bunch of cars like mach 1 mustang lincoln aviator etc, the mach 1 having the most hp (310). Now it also said the same engine has a supercharger from the factory the 03 and 04 cobra, but the block is iron, can those factory parts bolt on to the engine in my 95 Mark8?
 
also, can the parts from the aviator and mach 1 go on the 95 to give it some more power? I know it said something about they revised the heads. I also read that the teksid blocks were changed to windor in the later years but the windsor were weaker and people prefer the teksid. that true?
 
mustang-cobra-supercharged-engine.jpg
 
All the Mark 8s have what is known as the B style heads. These B head engines were built from 93 - 98. In 99 Ford came out with the C head or better known as the tumble port head. The major difference between the heads is that the B head has dual intake ports where as the C head has a large single intake port. Because of this no intake/supercharger parts from any of the C head DOHC engine produced from 99 + will bolt on to a B head engine such as those in all the Mark 8s. You would have to swap the heads to use any Mach I or Cobra Terminator induction parts.
 
Swapping over to the "C" style heads also gives more options for boosting as well, being a more popular head.
The other benefit to using a true Cobra short block was also the use of forged rods and pistons which were hand built on Ford's niche line in Romeo Michigan.
 
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Roadboss said:
Swapping over to the "C" style heads also gives more options for boosting as well, being a more popular head.
The other benefit to using a true Cobra short block was also the use of forged rods and pistons which were hand built on Ford's niche line in Romeo Michigan.
Click to expand...

Yes the C heads are more efficient than the B heads. There are more C heads available than the B heads and more parts for them. The B heads will out flow the C heads. But try and find parts for the B heads becomes difficult. The only intake choice for these is a full custom setup or the 96 - 98 Cobra. Then try and find all the parts and hardware to install them. Ford no longer carries these. I've got a customer right now with Fox bodied Mustang that I'm installing a 98 Mark engine with a 98 Cobra intake. I have the intake and IMRCs but try locating the stock fuel rails or any of the hardware is becoming a problem. Also the only positive displacement supercharges to fit these heads isn't inter cooled so high boost levels aren't advisable. You can use a centrifugal setup and an after cooler but you have to fabricate it all. This makes the C heads a better choice for serious hp.

As for the forged components, only the 03/04 Cobra came with the forged Manley rods, crank and pistons. The 96 - 98 Cobra came with a forged crank and stronger powdered metal rods, cast pistons. In 99 all the DOHC went to the weaker SOHC rods.
 
C heads bolt on no problem on the mark viii block? grab a eaton from one of the cobra guys who are always swapping chargers to leave many stock eatons around...
 
AbrahamLincoln said:
C heads bolt on no problem on the mark viii block? grab a eaton from one of the cobra guys who are always swapping chargers to leave many stock eatons around...
Click to expand...

You need a lot more than just an Eaton and C heads to get it to work. Not a good idea cost wise. Way better options out there like getting C heads and getting a KB for them like Roadboss has.
 
AbrahamLincoln said:
C heads bolt on no problem on the mark viii block?
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Well "no problem" being a relative term.

unless you are VERY skilled at working on a modular motor, you'd probably be better off NOT TAKING THE HEADS OFF.

I've seen more than 1 person screw up the cam timing and destroyed their engine because they "weren't as skilled" as they thought they were.

Taking apart a mod motor is NOT FOR BEGINNERS!

If you want to put an 03-04 cobra blower in your car, the BEST way to do so is to buy a COMPLETE 03-04 cobra motor and put it in

...that is ALOT easier than taking a mod motor apart.. and in the end, you're gonna come out ALOT cheaper by getting the whole motor complete.. rather than trying to "ebay" an engine together.

Unless you have 10K laying around, forget the
"I WANT A 03-04 COBRA MOTOR in my MARK 8".
10K would be a "low end" estimate as well.

By the time you get the engine and the supporting modifications {trans, ect}
you're gonna have a buttload of money spent

not to mention that chip you just got will be turned into a useless peice of plastic and you will need 100% Custom/Dyno tuning at a cost of several hundred dollars (4-$700.00) depending on the person doing the tuning.. of course.


Good luck
 
That is correct. Unless you know how to build a 4.6 Mod motor stay away from trying to build it yourself. It will cost you way more than it would if you took it to someone. We don't like having to fix someone elses mess so to say. The cost estimate Tommy posted will just cover the parts. At $65 an hour or so for labor and then a custom program unlike the cookie cutter you have now will cost you another $500. Dyno tuning if you go that way would be another $250. I've done several of these swaps by mail order also with great success. I wanted to be the first with the install into a Mark and Tbird but someone beat me to them both. I was the first to tune one of these setups though.
 
my estimate was on the very VERY LOW side

but consider the engine will cost somewhere between 5-8 grand ALONE.

Then a 4r70W that is built to "support such added power" is over 2K.

Add a 8-900.00 Torque Convertor

BOOM your 8-10K into it already and haven't even BEGAN to put the motor in the car.. or have it tuned.

not to mention the endless small parts that you will need in the process.

It all add up very very quickly.
 
Mad1stGen said:
Sure about that ?;)
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Yes I am, first one was in the spring of 04. I know of no other Mark or Tbird that had a swap done and tuned before then. Unless you count the two clone SVT Tbirds and the real ones that were destroyed. The 4 Marks and 2 Tbirds that show up here once in awhile with the swaps either started out with my mail order tune or were dyno tuned by me. There are a couple others out there with my programming but I didn't supply it. A couple of these earlier guys gave my programming to them and other tuners via PRP.
 
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There was one done here in MI sometime in the late 03, I forget which month exactly. It was a t-turd though. Trilogy soon followed suit with their kit for the marauders.

I assure you your tune wasn't used any of our swaps ;)
 
Here is what happened to a friend of mine..

he's got a 2000 Gran Marquis 2V 4.6

he got tired of our grandma cars running a full second quicker than his grandpa car could.

He asked me one day about doing a PI heads and cam swap
(a very popular and well documented swap)

I told him he'd come out cheaper and better putting a 2000+ GT motor and trans in his car, it already had the PI stuff and was factory assembled.

Found him a 2000 4.6 Engine and Trans at KarKraft.com for about $2800.00, would cost him about 800.00 more for the install.

he decided to do exactly the opposite, and on the downlow behind my back.

next thing I hear is his motor has bent rods, broken valves and screwed up pistons on 3 of the 8 holes..now the shop is putting in 3 rods, 3 pistons and a handful of exhaust valves.

They charged my buddy for all the replacement parts as well as the labor to R&R the motor AND for the headgaskets and headbolts... literally 1000's of dollars in parts.

They wouldn't stand behind any of the work because "the customer supplied the heads and cams" and said it "wasn't their fault" the pistons hit the valves.

They finally got the motor to "run and drive" out of the shop and it's a full second slower than it was.

NOW..he's 5-6 GRAND into a "heads and cam swap", and he went from 1 second slower than our cars to TWO seconds slower than our cars.

The tuner threw the WHOLE SCT BIBLE at the car trying to get the car to have some power on the bottom end.

They bought a new 600.00 TC to replace the "presumed bad" 600.00 TC that was in the car before.

the car is still a "complete DOG out of the hole"!

The guys that put the motor together the "second time" got the cam timing "close enough" to run.. but it still WRONG.

Based on what I know about cam timing.. the cam timing is retarded or the two cams are "not in sync"...dunno hard to say without once again.. TEARING it all apart again {at the customers expense)

The car is a pig out of the hole and about 3K on the tach it screams like hell all the way to past 6k...the power comes on like a light switch, from total bog to "i'm gonna blow up" screaming.

ET's went UP and his MPH went UP, the car is making good power, it just has "nothing" out of the hole...ala retarded cam timing.

this guy is stuck in a 4.6 cam timing nightmare, the original mechanics wont touch it.. "other mechanics" dont want to touch it..

all because the guy ignored the initial "dont touch it" warning.

IMHO for the average Joe, or shadetree mechanic, or non specialized auto repair shops would be better off "not opening a mod motor".

The cost of the headgaskets, headbolts and fliuds are almost 500.00 each time you "tear one down".

It just AINT LIKE the ole small block fords and chevys were do you did heads and cams swaps "in the yard".. anymore.
 
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