How long can Ford do this?

RE: How long can Ford do this?

Just by the nature of what we own - this is obviously a "domestic friendly" crowd - but what's happened in our particular case?

Is there a rightful replacement for the Mark8? As Sleeper mentioned - maybe the Cadillac - but not much else.

If you could see how fast the Ford executive fleet turned to Jaguar - once Ford bought the nameplate - it would make your head spin.

Imagine that the very managers and directors that profess to build "100 Years of Automotive Achievement" don't even want one in their driveway - the majority chosing an import - now that it's politically OK.

These are guys that are getting cars at cost - and they still can't justify their own nameplate. There are now more Jaguars being driven on the streets of Detroit then ever before - as well as Volvos for the middle managers. Heck even Edsel Ford's wife (who lives a few blocks away) dropped off young Henry the IIIrd at elementary school in a Land Rover - right in front of my Mark8.

More power to them - but I bet they really laugh when the hear some of us screaming "Buy American" and they drive by in a "conquest import". After all (they say) it's now a Ford, right?

"Beware the cook that won't eat at his own diner".
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

I dont agree with the pension stuff. As a cop, I have a very good pension. The advantage is that the state keeps very tight tabs on how much is taken in and how much is paid out. The police dept is not allowed to touch the money. With proper care our pension has more money in it than we could ever use. Even after the stock fell apart. If we chose to dissolve the fund, each member, both currently paying and retired would be given over a million dollars. I dont think Ford is having a problem with this. And if they do, they only have themselves to blame for dipping in the kiddy.

As for union pay, that again is unfair. I have been searching for the study, but cant find it. Top management is paid more in total dollars than all of the workers, yet there are far more workers. The union is smart and has actuaries look at the books and figure out exactly how much profit the company will make and what their projected sales will be. They then go and bargain for what they believe their employees share should be. I never see top management and executives having a problem making grossly outragious amounts of money and huge pay raises.

Somebody mentioned suppliers being forced to lower their prices. The company with the worst record of this is dodge. You want to see a company who will be out of business very soon, then look at dodge. They have squeezed their suppliers profits so short that they have left the suppliers with no other option than to quit selling to them or lower the quality of product. This is across the board. Their products quality will be so poor withing 5 years that nobody will buy what they are making.

I suspect that part of the reason that the foreign companies are doing so well is because of tax breaks. I am not sure if it is still happening, but many of them were not paying any state or local taxes for their products. This was implimented by the states so they could get their people to work.
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

Tax breaks aren't just for furrin automakers. A lot of the domestics have factories that aren't being taxed, but they also have the old ones around that are being taxed.

Dodge? Low quality? Nooooooo..... really? LOL. I know plenty of people who still won't buy a chrysler based on quality problems they had in the '70's and '80's. Personally, though, if i had the money to buy the truck i want, it'd be a dodge, but it'd be powered by cummins :).
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

Here's what the rumor-mill has to say about DODGE:-

Mer-SAY-deees has, from "Day-1" not liked much about the corporation that they Hi-Jacked. With no knowledge of how to market an entry level vehicle, they shot Plymouth & fataly wounded her. (Remember, in 1970, Plymouth sold 300,000 cars!!)

Chrysler had a full line of new swoopy sexy entry level cars ready to bring to market, all badged as Plymouths. THESE were not the kind of cars Mer-SAY-dees knew anything about marketing, so.....the Plymouth Touring Cruiser was waaay too far along to even consider a 3rd trimester abortion, so they simply re-badged it as the "P.T. Cruiser, and as they say...and gave it to Chrysler, the rest is history. The remaining 3 concepts, they aborted. Dead Plymouth. They decided to bring Chrysler down to $31,000. The operative decession was that NO Chrysler CAR (Excluding Minivans & Sport Utes....) CAR CAR CAR, could have a sales price over $31,000 (excluding Viper & Crossfire). The most expensive Chrysler 4 or 6 passenger car is the Concorde Limited, which takes the place of the former LHS, which took the place of the New Yorker. Fully loaded she's $31,200.00 ~ Chrysler was told that it no longer competed in the Luxury Level of the market.
Now, they turn their attention to DODGE.
The word is that they cannot understand dual marketing of the same vehicle. (like GM & Ford do) So since like Ford & Mercury, many Dodge & Chrysler models are the same vehicle (basically) that Dodge CARS are now not guaranteed PAST the forthcoming MAGNUM Station Wagon. That is the last Dodge, as of now, with a GREEN LIGHT !! After that runs its 3 year course, Mer-SAY-dees wants to make DODGE DIVISION the TRUCK division. They will market ONLY trucks. Durango, lower priced minivans, and pick-ups and heavy duty work trucks. Dead, and not to be replaced will be: Intrepid, Stratus, Neon. The UNofficial word is that the Viper will be re-badged as a Chrysler Viper. Some, much or none of this could change, but this is the (Hush Hush word on "the street" as of now).

But remember, in ""Daimler-Chrysler"" ~ the "Chrysler is silent" !
Also.... Remember that in "Daimler" the "ler" IS FOR the "ler" in chrysLER..... ('Ya, right).....
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

Sandy,

I had seen photos of a new Intrepid, however it is now a hatchback...
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

I agree with almost everything said except those that thinking that buying only american is helping anything. Buying american is making little profit for the big 3 and they are just putting your money into labor and other excessive management costs.

I, for one, will buy the best car out there for my $, i dont care where it comes from or what company makes it....
Click to expand...

Danoz93,

Capitalize American when you talk about people from my country. This is the greatest country in the world because the people have the freedom to keep it great with open dialogue such as this. Have enough respect to raise your little pinky finger and put it on the shift key!

I disagree with your opening paragraph. Your job depends on people buying your product. If people don't buy what you're selling, you'll be out of business. How are you going to buy anything without a job? How will they buy your product if they don't have a jobe?

I brought up the subject of the demise of the American manufacturing industry to a liberal friend of mine yesterday. I asked him to agree that it is hard to find any products not made in China because of the selling of the Lincoln bedroom to Johnny Chung. He said, "Absolutely not. It's corporate greed that drives our jobs overseas. Corporations are evil, every one of them!" I responded, "Well Bob, I don't know about that. I have worked for several corporations and I own stock in some of them. If it weren't for American corporations, what would we do for a job? I think they call that Socialism." He walked away declaring that corporations are evil, greedy institutions.

The American corporations have been demonized to the point that they can't survive without moving their factories overseas. The foreign corporations move in with healthy tax incentives from state and local governments for the sake of restoring jobs in our Right-to-work states. Jobs that were lost because we blindly refuse to insist on the "Made in U.S.A." label. Sure, corporations are looking for the best value and the greatest profits. It is up to us to support or reject what they are selling with our purchases.

As for your second paragraph, it really will make a difference if we all get on the same side. We need to buy American if available. If an American made product is not available, do what I do. Don't buy it unless you absolutely need it now! We should all recognize that we are lavishly spoiled brats who buy way more than we need. We can control ourselves. So what if your choice of an American product doesn't appear to be the greatest value choice upon its purchase. It's the job that you save, stupid Americans! Don't buy the trivial items if they are made in China. Save your money to buy the American made items that you really need to support your fellow American's job! If we don't, we'll be a welfare state (See USSR).

We can also control how our jobs are being lost by recognizing which politicians are selling out to foreign corporations. They are truly traitors and should be voted out of office, if not jailed for treason. Pay attention.
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

"Remember, in 1970, Plymouth sold 300,000 cars!!"

Yes but in 1966 Ford sold more than double that # of Mustangs & that's just one model of the Ford line. Ford sold over 158K Mustangs last year

Last year Ford sold more Taurus' than that and now people are saying Fords in trouble. (+275K so far this year)

"The word is that they cannot understand dual marketing of the same vehicle. (like GM & Ford do)"

They should take lessons from Toyota, and Nissan. :)


http://members.tccoa.com/lastmrk/Images/lastmrk2.jpg
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

I am printing that, and buying a frame made in the USA and framing it & hanging it on my wall, and re-sizing it to small and inserting it into my Bible, for it is 100% GOSPEL

Amen, brother Dave !!
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

I see Dave,

So what about that fancy PC on your desktop running with Hyundai RAM?? (Hyundai was the largest manufacturer of RAM in the world) LOL And I suppose all your clothing is US made too, right?? I had this discussion before, many times with my American friends. They said they like buying American clothing, but "holy crap" are they expensive. Double or triple. And the cornballs in your US government just passed a "made in the USA" bill for military systems. Then they changed their mind and altered the wording cause the higher ups in the military said that all of the fancy electronincs we rely on for our systems are made overseas. If we are no longer able to use that stuff, our military will be screwed. LOL I agree 100% with Danoz. I'm not a blind sheep and buy domestic just for the sake of buying domestic. I work hard for my $$ and will buy the best bang for my buck, even if it means buying foreign. I work in the auto industry, and this is what it is like dealing with foreign and domestics.

DOMESTIC: "The part is too expensive, can you make it cheaper??"

FOREIGN: "That part isn't good enough, can you make it better??"

That's a FACT. On some Lexus molds they nickle plate the things!! HUGE $$$$ to do so. We recently had the Caddy SRX mold in for repairs. We told them for us to do it right, most of it would have to be scrapped, and re-done from scratch. No f-ing way we were told. Get it as close as you can with what you have and just leave it. That's a top US brand telling us to cobble it together. Nice. And I won't go as far to say US corporation are EVIL, but they will do almost anything to save a buck. The new mini SUV from GM will have Chinese made engines in it. The quality will likely be on par, but they will be saving a few bucks per engine. That's more important for them that "saving face" with the American public.

Greed is a huge motivating factor. Just last week, many lumber prices doubled in cost. I was told because of the fires in California, there was suddenly a wood shortage!! Wood shortage?? More like everyone in CA will need to buy wood for new houses, so lets gouge them. LOL Corporations aren't EVIL, just excessively greedy. And it's beacuse people like you who own stock. Cause the stockholders DEMAND huge profits so it's actually worthwhile to own their stock. SO I BLAME YOU DAVE!! FOR EVERYTHING BAD AND EVIL IN THE US!!! LOL AND I STUBBED MY TOE THIS MORNING, AND THAT'S YOUR FAULT TOO!!! LOL :)
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

My main problem with American vehicles now - they're just plain **UGLY**. Either retro, unbalanced, (like the Crossfire - great front end design, but the rear looks like a retro @ss with its tail between its legs), or as Sandy said - the new GTO looks like a Cavalier! The Lincoln LS might as well be a Diamante - even I have to look twice to tell them apart. Or else they design something like the GT40 or XLR, then price it totally out of range of the average buyer. The few decent styles, (90s T-Birds, Mark VIIIs, Camaros, Firebirds, etc.), have all been discontinued...

American makers need to get their *designs* back in gear, to again inspire people - then they'll get buyers back. Right now, foreign designs are just beating the crap out of US designs, and at reasonable prices - the G35 being a great example of reasonably priced good design. What does Ford give us instead? A hugely overpriced retro 2-seat T-Bird...now being discontinued because of poor sales, (I wonder why...)

John
http://mark8.org/users/johnaec/Mark_VIII_s.jpg
'97 Mark VIII LSC
'96 T-Bird 4.6L
 
RE: How long can Ford do this?

LOL I agree 100% with Danoz. I'm not a blind sheep and buy domestic just for the sake of buying domestic. I work hard for my $$ and will buy the best bang for my buck, even if it means buying foreign. I work in the auto industry, and this is what it is like dealing with foreign and domestics.

DOMESTIC: "The part is too expensive, can you make it cheaper??"

FOREIGN: "That part isn't good enough, can you make it better??"
Click to expand...

Exactly,
Thanks Ron

I work for an automotive supplier who deals heavily with the big 3 and i see that same thing, "make it cheaper no matter what the quality cost."

If the american auto industry is going down then i will go work for an import company, Americans need cars and they need good ones. The whole auto industry wont go away, it will just shift to import companies untill there are no more "American companies", however, american people will still have jobs in america building cars for americans, its just that the corporation will not be American.

Cars arent going away, it doesnt matter who makes them they will always be here. If non-american companies are producing them, they will need american labor and land so the jobs will shift, not go away.

It is not my responsibility to agree with bad decisions of "American" companies
 
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