Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

E

eduncan911

Registered
Letting you guys know while I was down here finishing up a friend's turbo coupe (and tuning it), he asked if i wanted to go to the Test/n/Tune tonight in Memphis. Figured, why not run the Mark?

For you that don't know, it's a bone stock 1995 non-LSC. Purchased the car with a locked up engine. Put in a stock Mark VIII short block (freshened up w/new bearings, rings), cleaned up my old 96 Cobra heads and built the motor with Lincoln Navigator camshafts (couldn't leave it stock).

But I added exactly 217lbs with the stereo and sub/MB Quarts, etc. I weigh 165lbs, and the car had 1/4 tank.

I was disappointed. I thought I could get off a high 14 pass before I began. I tried every combination, manually shifting vs computer, vs air ride on/off, power braking to 1700 and "from idle" lanches, traction control on/off, etc. Hood open/closed for cooling, etc.

The car was extremely consistant through 14 passes (no matter what combinations above) and a temp change of 13 degrees from when I got there to when I left (at closing).

Best Pass: 15.100 @ 94.34mph
Worse Pass: 15.181 @ 93.66mph

Best ET: 15.100 (94.34mph)
Best MPH: 94.88 (15.138s)

Worse ET: 15.181 (93.66mph)
Worse MPH: 93.34 (15.144s)

Best 60': 2.220
Worse 60': 2.289


Good/bad? Bone stock with air filter and all. Thought about pulling the belt, filter, etc. Nahh, I wanted to know the best I could pull off before the stroked andbig bore (5.2) goes in over the next year ("my" cammer motor I am calling it). Obviously built tranny, rear end, stall, gears, etc. Give me a year or two.

Don't know what these cars run bone stock. Let me know how this compares.

Eric
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

If you removed that added weight you probably would have made it into the 14s. Those are some nice 60ft times. Car runs about where a stock mk8 would run.
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

Those times sound about right. What are the differences in the specs between the navi cams and the mark cams?
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

When were you Memphis? I try to go every Thursday night, but I obviously missed your Mark. I ran last Thursday and ran (4) 14.0s with my 93. I look for others, but I always seem to be the only one in a sea of stangs,LS1s, vettes.
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

In lines with a stock Mark eh? Damn it. Thought at least I had a few more MPH then stock ones with the Navi cams. Can't remove the weight. All custom made into the car/doors/etc. Well, knowing I had the extra weight and I was inline with stock Marks... Guess that's one thing to be happy about.

The difference is the exhaust cam in the Marks (from what Crower told me when I sent a set in from a Mark for regrinding) has -3 degrees of retard on the lobes from a stock set of Cobra exhaust cams. The lift seems a bit lower as well, 0.390" vs. a Cobra's 0.399". Duration seemed the same.

Navigator cams is what all 2003/04 4.6L DOHC motors now use. Including the new Mercury Marauder, 2003/04 Mach1s, and even the Supercharged 2003/04 Cobras. What the specs are, I don't know. I had a set reground by Crower I haven't used yet, to some hellaous specs (cammer motor I'm thinking of building for the Mark). 280/288 dur, .495" lift. :)

Get this though, the 2003-Present Navigators have a different camshaft in them now. Makes things interesting...

The exhaust cam part number was replaced by the 99-01 cobra part number in 2002.


Oh well... How much do these things weigh stock?
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.


When were you Memphis? I try to go every Thursday night, but I obviously missed your Mark. I ran last Thursday and ran (4) 14.0s with my 93. I look for others, but I always seem to be the only one in a sea of stangs,LS1s, vettes.
[/quote]

I was there last night (Tuesday) for the first "Tuesday" test-n-tune. I live in Nashville and was down tuning my friend's Turbo Coupe. It's running very well (needs to be broken in over 500 miles, 331ci with P70 Turbo). Only issue with it is something wrong with the oil drain (it's backing up, causing sever smoking out the tail pipe). He'll be at the track again soon. He has a 95 GT with a gold mystic-type paint on it. He's there every Thursday (and most Tuesdays from what he told me).

The 60' times were the best by completely loading up the converter, air ride on, and using the traction control (yes, believe it or not). Then again, remember it's mostly stock so if you have more power you'll break the tires loose more then I was and the traction control may hender you. Also remember the car has over 91k miles on the body. Stock and loose/worn shocks/struts/bags/bushings and all (it REALLY picks the front end up from what people told me).

This car would make an excellent bracket racer. I was off by 0.002s and 0.04MPH by 2 back to back runs running exactly the same (shifting at 6400rpms). The varience in times, 60', and MPH was me experimenting short shifting/revving past normal, flashing the converter, traction control, etc. Trying to get the best time. Found out I can only make the car about 0.08s and 1MPH faster by fully loading up the converter and manually shifting it at 6400rpms. Then rolling off the line completely in stock trim (stage, light comes down, floor to WOT with traction control, and letting the computer slip-shift the tranny normally).


What sucks about the whole night... It was only like around 5000rpms in 2nd across the finish line at 94mph. Man, these need a gear BAD!
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

What did the Turbo Coupe run?

I have an '88 TC 5-speed with a K&N cone filter and the boost cranked up to 18 psi. It'd obliterate my '93 Mark off the line, but at speed it doesn't have a chance. It's a neat car, but when I look in my driveway and decide which car to drive, 9 times out of 10 it's the Lincoln. :)
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.


got any pics of the stereo and a little more detail about it?
[/quote]
Not really. Too busy with other things and my camera broke. Kicker SX-900.4 amps (tested output at 1100W RMS each), single L7 sub, 8" midbasses, MB Quart 6.5 Premiums all the way around, etc. :)

And I still have almost my entire trunk (it was the way i designed it).
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.


What did the Turbo Coupe run?
I have an '88 TC 5-speed with a K&N cone filter and the boost cranked up to 18 psi. It'd obliterate my '93 Mark off the line, but at speed it doesn't have a chance. It's a neat car, but when I look in my driveway and decide which car to drive, 9 times out of 10 it's the Lincoln.
[/quote]
It's not broke in yet as it has been sitting, building upon for almost 2 years. I went down to give the guy a kick in the ass to get it on the road. All motor it ran a granny shifting 11.5 ET (331 forged stroker @ 8.2:1 compression, gutted car, 6pt cage, etc). He still has an oil issue (blowing oil past the seals). I think it's too high of oil pressure, he thinks it's the drain line (which looks fine to me). Oh well, big event coming May 8th and we'll see what it runs then.

Now with the turbo in place, at around 16 to 20psi (when tuned), look out 10s (or 9s as he thinks he is going to run). I'm guessing these 302/331/347 "5.0" motors can handle that much boost. I was pushing 24psi through my STOCK 4.6L DOHC Cobra, before the rebuild. At which time I "upped the boost" even further, on 93 octane. ;)

Eric
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

I know some smart people highly reccomend navigator cams.
I have said it once and will say it again, I do not see the point of replacing mediocre stock parts with other mediocre SUV stock parts. There is a plethora of aftermarket parts out there for these engines now.
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

I made over 700rwhp with my "stock" Cobra cams, and got 24mph. Who needs aftermarket cams at a $1000 a set? The stock Mark exhaust cams won't cut it, especially if you do an intake swap and open up the exhaust.

I built the motor seperately on a stand, and didn't have any other cams laying around except a set of Navi cams. So it was economical for me. Tearing your motor apart to "just" install Navi cams and nothing more, I don't recommend.

Even though that's what I am right now. *doh* I plan installing my oem 96 Cobra intake (after I cut it up) left over from my 96 build up (fabricated an intake for that project). I plan on installing some type of headers, if I don't end up with a turbo project. That's a year or two off (have to build another project first to drive, while this one would be down).

Eric
 
RE: Went to the track, with Navi Cams.

Cams can be readily had for 5-600$ these days depending on which company you prefer to do buisness with. Billit cams are still quite expensive though. I think 600$ for 25rwhp is a good deal myself. I went with a set of Crane radical regrinds(575$), and FRPP kit (1255 cams+valves+rockers+springs+seals) myself. The amount of power that can be made with cams is well worth the money IMO.
 
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