What levels the rear bags?

cobra98lsc

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Sometimes i catch the right rear 1/2 inch lower than the passenger what would cause that?
Since both on the same sensor?

I have at one point jacked up the rear and pulled both solenoids and let the bags even out then fill back up,, but to no avail they end up crooked again sometimes and i think that is whats causing my steering wheel to change off center.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Really? so based on the input from the font sensors the system adjusts the leveling on the rear... makes sense i sort of expected that was the trick of using only one sensor in back wich apparently only controls height.

Is there any way to check for a sticky solenoid?

I just cant get this car to stay striaght, its killing me.

When air system is on the car is raised to its below 55mph hieght the wheel is straight alingment looks good on rack but when it loweres the wheel with cock to the right 10-15 degrees.

Not even the dealers can help me and i have had 6 alingments in 4 months.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

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Really? so based on the input from the font sensors the system adjusts the leveling on the rear... makes sense i sort of expected that was the trick of using only one sensor in back wich apparently only controls height.Is there any way to check for a sticky solenoid? I just cant get this car to stay striaght, its killing me.When air system is on the car is raised to its below 55mph hieght the wheel is straight alingment looks good on rack but when it loweres the wheel with cock to the right 10-15 degrees.Not even the dealers can help me and i have had 6 alingments in 4 months.
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Yup, I hated the air suspension because of that... the car would never sit straight. So I lowered it and fine tuned the sensors (this took a longggggg time) and finally got it perfectly done.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

I have had it,,, i have never owned a car that would never keep a straight steering wheel.

I am ready to remove the system completely or just sell the damned car and buy a Lexus or something that stays put for 100k miles
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

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I have had it,,, i have never owned a car that would never keep a straight steering wheel.I am ready to remove the system completely or just sell the damned car and buy a Lexus or something that stays put for 100k miles
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Oh, I never got the car to go straight no matter what, i chanaged thousands of dollars worth of suspension parts, but the car wasnt having it. I only got it to Sit straight after countless hours fine tuning the sensors. Going straight, or even getting rid of the loose steering was only possible in theory, much less the vibrations.

I now enjoy tight, dead center steering, without ANY vibration. I can let go of the steering wheel at 120Mph and the car will still go sold stright, and lets me see the objects in my rear view mirror (knock on wood).

The Steering and vibrations were the #1 reason that made me want to sell the car, so when my family came, it was the perfect excuse.

Note: I had that car aligned at least 8 or 9 times, each one accompanied more and more new parts.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Well it sounds like you have done the same things i have done.
Rebuilt the whole entire car, front end etc
Upper Arms
Lower Arms
All joints, bushings, 4 sets of Radius arm bushings
Poly everything,Dynotech drive shaft,Struts,rack,rod ends,tires only last 6-8months in the front then the outer edges go bye bye, steering is all over the damend road follows crowns and ruts like nothing i have ever seen, never feels stabil at any speed, wanders like a drunk at 70+ and overall just miserable to drive it anymore.
And since 30k miles its been this way.
Wasnt like this new so i figured rebuilding car would make it like new again. NOT!!!

Guessing i need to give up and buy a Lexus maybe a GS 400-430
I drove a friends GS300 thats also a 98 with 110k on it and it feels like new dead centered always tight and smooth, My steering wheel will move 20-30 degrees off center depending on what angle the road is at... I see other cars next to me with thier wheels nice and level and only driving with one finger not 2 hands, knees and wandering... Hell my car scares people in the next lane away from me..
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

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... When air system is on the car is raised to its below 55mph hieght the wheel is straight alingment looks good on rack but when it loweres the wheel with cock to the right 10-15 degrees. Not even the dealers can help me and i have had 6 alingments in 4 months.
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I have mine aligned with the suspension turned off with the car at the lowered/parked height. I thought this was the norm?
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Yeah, I have done it that way every time.

2 times we tried with on and running, then with me in the driver seat on and running.

1. Align with off and parked hieght
wheel will be straight at 60 or above and cock to left when goes to raised height below 50

2. Align with car raised and then it will drive straight with when raised hieght but cocks to the right when lowers.

I think i have found the solution.

Feb 2005 i buy a Lexus GS300 and be done with all this money pit. I just cant take the aggrivation anymore. I think this is the reason Ford killed this chassis off.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Well, something's not set up right on your car, though I couldn't tell you what. I've put almost 50K miles on my Mark VIII and it drives perfectly straight with a centered steering wheel, alignment is perfect with no tire wear or pull, and if I turn the wheel and let go of it, it virtually snaps back to center. There's not some inherent design flaw with the Mark VIII, rather something particular to your car or the way it's getting aligned.

John
[link:www.goldengatemark8.com|Golden Gate Mark VIII Website]
http://mark8.org/users/johnaec/Mark_VIII_s.jpg
'97 Mark VIII LSC
'96 T-Bird 4.6L
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

John its stories like this that give me hope..

Nice Mark too like the wheels.

I am going to the shop tomorrow to do my own alignment with 2 techs there. Talked to Owner Operator of the Brake check and he setup the deal for me to do this one myself,

Any advice on specs?
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Oh yeah and this car never centers itself up ever.. just sort of wanders where you point it.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

I know you replaced the power steering rack, but what about the pump and pressure lines ?
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Hmmmmmmm, doing it yourself...

I believe there is a 'range' of alignment specs, and if I remember there is also a 'preffered' spec in that range which is NOT necessarily mid-range. I remember the readout on mine showed near perfect for the front but one of the rear wheels, while in 'spec', was noticeably off from 'preffered'.

Now to people like you and I, anything very far from 'preffered' would not be acceptable, but may very well indeed be 'good enough' for most others. It would probably take me, ohhh, two days to do an alignment on my own car. lol :7

Isn't there 'performance' specs as far as alignment? I wonder how much different from factory that would be.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

TIRES!!!!

I had my '94 aligned countless times, and there was nothing else wrong in the suspension. I finally sold it, bought a '97, and after awhile, went through the same stuff. Shortly after i bought the '97, I bought new tires for it, it was fine, i drove it for a couple years and it eventually would wander all over no matter what. I fixed some supsension components here and there, but i knew nothing was wrong based on my inspections as well as inspections from others. I ended up swapping rims with a friend because i was taking a trip and my tires were bald, and i didn't want to buy new ones yet. As soon as we swapped, from my bald generals to his cracked good years, the car went straight as an arrow. No more wandering, pulling, none of that. Straight as an arrow. He put my tires on his car and started complaining right away. All over the road. He had a crappy suspension, needed wheel bearings, upper ball joints, and some other stuff, but on his tires, his car went straight, on mine, it wandered. My suspension was tight, but it was the same story. On my tires it sucked, on his tires it was great.

Also, some shops do better alignments than others. Steer clear of sears.

The rear bags operate together at all times. The system senses the height of both fronts and adjusts them individually to get the car level side to side, and at the right height, then it opens both rear bags at the same time and adjusts it until the left rear wheel is at the right height. With both bags open, the pressure will equalize naturally between them, so if you put the right rear on a curb, the pressure goes up, and when the system tries to lower the rear (even with the right rear up the left rear will be high, so the system will open both rears and the vent solenoid until the left rear is at the proper level) the extra pressure from the side on the curb will force air out and into the other bag or out the vent solenoid, until the pressure between the bags is equalized or the solenoids are closed.


Basically the car will adjust the height so that the sensors at both fronts and the left rear read correctly. When it adjusts the rear, both bags are adjusted at once.

I could throw some more engineering babble at you as to why it's good to do it that way (corner weights, etc) but you probably don't care. If your car isn't level side to side, adjust a front sensor. If that doesn't do it, make sure the solenoids are all functioning.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

I have done a bunch of alignments in my days,,, i can run most machines.
Bottom line is they have my castor so far back that the tires are rubbing the damned fender wells on turns, and the strut rods are out of threats on the front nuts..
SIA must be so far off its insane, and when i questioned them about SIA they stated they dont measure that and dont know what it is!!
Anyhow I am going to move Castor to the middle of the threads and then set camber as negative as possible within spec, toe close to zero or -.02 per side following that i will re-adjust the castor to specs close to 5.0 or 5.5 then re-adjust my toe to match.
Planning to do this with system in parked hieght then fire it up let it raise and level while on the rack and watch the toe angle with the steering wheel locked in place at Centered if any toe moves on one side more than the other then i found the problem that is pulling the steering wheel off center.
I have never seen a car with such a #### loose and piss poor design as this.. I hate this strut rod nonsense... loose and they move no matter how many bushings we replace.
The front wheels shouldnt move foward and backwards ever! No good car does this. I shouldnt feel the wheels slam forward and back in the fenders when i hit brakes. thats just wrong.
Well see i will post my results tomorrow once i finish the work.
Positive Castor = lots of centering return right?
I want this sucker to SNAP to center.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

Mine centers so well that i have to hold on tight in the turns, and when i hit a bump it will still try to return to center.

The wheels shouldn't move forward and backward unless something is seriously wrong. Something other than the alignment.
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

No advice on the specs. I go to an alignment shop where the owner used to own a lowered SC T-Bird and is really familiar with the 4 wheel alignments. What I really question is how you say your front wheels move back and forth when you stop - as far as I know there shouldn't be any play like that...

John
[link:www.goldengatemark8.com|Golden Gate Mark VIII Website]
http://mark8.org/users/johnaec/Mark_VIII_s.jpg
'97 Mark VIII LSC
'96 T-Bird 4.6L
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

I agree nothing should be moving. I think somethign is still whacky with the radius arm aka strut rod bushings... i will check it out on rack tomorrow.

Your car is nice looking BTW ..

I am just after that mustang GT like feeling in the steering really solid and tight not vague and wandering. Did the Cobra R's and lower profile rubber help any?
 
RE: What levels the rear bags?

If you replaced the strut rod to frame bushings with moog parts, there was a batch of bushings that had the sleeve too long. It needs to be 2-3/4 instead of 3". I know this was the case on my friend's car. After complete rebuilt, within a week or so we could hear the poping sound when suddenly braking or taking off. It took 10 mins pers side to replace the sleeve with a 2-3/4 piece of pipe. Works perfect so far.
 
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