03-25-07 T&t

After a long day at the dynotune in Richmond, I drove to Hagerstown, MD to be at a private track rental the following morning. The weather was sunny and warm in Richmond, but wet, foggy and cool when I arrived in H-town. With no chance to dry overnight, I awoke at 6AM to find the morning event canceled. The track still managed to open for the regular schedule of the day at noon - the first day of T&T.

Since I was there... :big-grin:

As usual, the place was packed. All month, the weekend test and tunes had been cancelled due to weather. The track opening had been much anticipated. I arrived before 11 and was ready to run when they made the call to the staging lanes shortly after noon. I was second in line in the lanes. Needless to say after a long winter nap, both the track and driver were in need of getting back into shape.

After warming up the Hoosiers, I lined up against a Super Stock S-10. I had him at the beginning but he quickly gained separation and pushed the truck to the win light.

Car - 31(me) / 693(S-10)
R/T - .225 / .191
60' - 1.924 / 2.189
330' - 5.740 / 5.692
1/8 - 8.883 / 8.594
MPH - 78.73 / 84.31
1000 - 11.583 / 11.110
1/4 - 13.866 / 13.241
MPH - 100.74 / 105.73

It was difficult to tell if I spun off the line but the track conditions left a lot to be desired. The car stuttered a bit at the 1-2 shift. It was not unusual for the first run to less than expected. And later in the pits I found my cooling fan bypass was malfunctioning and needed a fuse for some unknown reason.

About an hour and a half later, the call to the lanes came. I decided to try the other lane this time and found myself against an unknown older model TransAm.

Car - 93(T/A) / 31(me)
R/T - .096 / .099
60' - 2.312 / 1.899
330' - 6.284 / 5.619
1/8 - 9.463 / 8.698
MPH - 77.85 / 79.59
1000 - 12.173 / 11.371
1/4 - 14.452 / 13.632
MPH - 99.18 / 98.93

Approaching to stage, I couldn't resist and reached down and opened the cutouts. We came off the tree door to door and it wasn't long the opponent was trailing and in my mirror. After picking up the slip, I returned to the pits. At first glance the 13.6 felt better, but the MPH made me wonder. Then I noticed the long awaited goal of 1.8s in the sixty foot had finally been acheived, albeit just barely. :big-grin:

Now things were getting ugly. Breakdowns on the track and a couple of license runs and Gamblers races meant a 3 hour wait. The car was bone cold when I finally arrived in the lanes again beside some Pro Chevy driver. He asked what my car weighed and was suprised at the answer. I'm not sure he was suprised it was heavy and ran so well or it was not as heavy as he thought since he remarked something about his weight. Regardless, I knew from the numbers on his car, I was out matched.

Car - 31(me) / 999(Chevy)
R/T - .155 / .032
60' - 1.921 / 1.853
330' - 5.678 / 5.124
1/8 - 8.803 / 7.869
MPH - 79.36 / 88.86
1000 - 11.497 / 10.274
1/4 - 13.768 / 12.326
MPH - 101.18 / 109.76

The slip didn't suprise me as I felt the car just wasn't where it needed to be, despite the MPH. I learned later there was a pretty stiff headwind during the run as the breezes had been shifting during the day. Even though it was late, I kept the tires on the car hoping for just one more call. But alas, there was no more runs to be made and I packed up the gear and headed home with just as many unanswered questions as I came with. The density altitude averaged over 2000 feet throughout the day, pretty high for this time of year, so that didn't help either.

With only 3 runs, not much testing and tuning was accomplished. On the two hour ride home I felt the car starting to miss under load. I have new plugs that arrived too late for the tune, hopefully that's the cure for that. It would've been nice to been able to run at the private rental and get some real testing done for the start of the season.

But all in all, had a good time, got a new sixty foot record and nothing broke!

Looks great JP Any more mods in the works? Could your new stall speed be costing you the 2/10's from 60' to half track? How about IMRC's?

3 runs did nothing to tell me much of anything, positive or negative. My reaction times were off a bit, but that's to be expected with any new setup. After virtually any major mod it has taken time to hone the reaction time down.

The sixty foot times seemed good and it appears that the corrected ET is lower than last year's for the most part. Comparing ETs in similar air at the same track from last year shows a tenth better by the 330' mark up to 1-1/2 to 2 tenths better at the end of the track. But it's impossible to establish any trend with the minimal number of runs. I was really hoping to run at the private rental and get 12 or more passes in and to try different things with the new mods.

If you're asking if i plan to delete the IMRCs, the answer is no. In the past when I have disabled them, the car was slower and streetability was affected.

New mods? Nothing major, except perhaps a fair bit of suspension work. New shocks, shock mounts and poly bushings for the rear control arms should help the short times, especially with some planned subframe connectors.

I'm looking forward to playing with the spyder valve and installing the ASHAM8 module for the air suspension. With the cutouts I need extra road clearance at times and I have reversed the sensor lowering back to stock. With the new module I'll be able to adjust the suspension as I wish, stock height or even higher when I need it and lowered for highway cruising and at the track. I'm hoping to experiment with the spyder valve and possibly alter the air suspension to optimize the launch at the track.

I have fair bit of maintenance issues to address, possibly including a new radiator as I have been noticing some slight leakage from the bottom of the radiator but not enough to pinpoint the source. Spark plugs and wires are due for replacement as well. I have an extra heavy duty relay to install for the cooling fan bypass.

Then there's always the detail work and appearance items. When cleaning and polishing the other day, I was amazed at the number of 'touchups' that are going to need to be done with only one year of wear and tear. Although the car may be old and drove hard, I like for it to look like new as much as possible.

Congrats on your new "SHORT TIME"!!!
1.89 60' is "LEAVIN HARD"!

WTG JP!

sorry you didn't get more passes, if you ever get the inkling to head this far south.. we can get you to a track where you can make "endless" time trials.
In a normal pre race test n tune session we usually get 9 passes atleast.

I usually only make 4 to keep on my "cool down schedule", but if one so desired you could run lap, after lap, after lap.. cool down for an hour and repeat as needed..

congrats again on your new best short time sir!

Thanks Tommy! You don't know how many times I'm at the track I ask myself... "What would Tommy do?"

Used to be at this track, you could count on more runs, maybe an hour in between runs and then virtually hot-lapping towards the end after the big boys packed up their trailers. Now about the only time you get more than 3 runs in is at a private club rental, an usually hot day or when some other Baltimore-DC area track has a big event going on.

With the cooling fan bypass functioning correctly, I can run laps at 5-10 minute intervals no problems with good consistency. For optimum ET's I've found a 45 minute 'pause' in the action to be good.

But 2-3 hours or more in between runs just kills me. It throws everything off for me. Reaction times, launches, ET, trap speed and most importantly, dial-in are all over the map with these long delays. Changing conditions at the track have a lot to do with it but I'm convinced the car does not perform up to par as well. I just 'feel' it, sometimes a bog, a stutter or something doesn't quite feel right during the run. In competition, I find it all the more difficult. On occasion, I've been blessed with a 'bye' run after a long delay, and it's likely a good thing.

driller said:

Thanks Tommy! You don't know how many times I'm at the track I ask myself... "What would Tommy do?"

For optimum ET's I've found a 45 minute 'pause' in the action to be good. .

Click to expand...

45 minutes between runs is a good cool down, that is roughly about the time "between rounds" at our track, plus 15 or so minutes as the folks trickle into the staging lanes.

Tiff goes up first.. and I sit and wait until almost "last call"... so I get a good cool down.

I have also found myself asking "what would JP do" when faced with changing my dial in "late in the race".. more times than not... I put on my poker face.. and "LET IT RIDE" and drive my car to the dial in..

One thing I have found.. if the car gets "too cold".. it'll bog/stutter like you describe, so I make a decent attempt to get "some heat" in the motor rather than trying to "stay as cool as possible".

I wonder if it could be related to the temp that the PCM switches from cold start fuel to base fuel table... {HMMMM) something to think about.

The cold start fuel table is "very very lean", I wonder if I could fatten up that table to prevent such a "difference" in the settings, without a good deal of testing it's only speculation at this point.. but I'm pretty sure that by the time I "get to the lanes".. and move forward each time a pair of cars go to the stripe.. then.. do my burnout.. by this time.. I'm fairly sure my car is above the "temp to switch to base fuel"...
BUT.. later in the race.. .such as the semi's or the finals.. I might not be above that temp..HMMMMM

dangit.. I think we've just discovered "another way to LOSE".
the more I learn.. the longer I do this.. the more ways to lose I invent!
HAHA

XLRVIII said:

The cold start fuel table is "very very lean", I wonder if I could fatten up that table to prevent such a "difference" in the settings, without a good deal of testing it's only speculation at this point.. but I'm pretty sure that by the time I "get to the lanes".. and move forward each time a pair of cars go to the stripe.. then.. do my burnout.. by this time.. I'm fairly sure my car is above the "temp to switch to base fuel"...
BUT.. later in the race.. .such as the semi's or the finals.. I might not be above that temp..HMMMMM

Click to expand...

I've heard that the transition from cold start to base tables is a TIMED temperature event. Even if the ECT is still low after a certain time the PCM will switch from the cold start strategy.

I've always assumed by the time I get to & through the staging lanes and do a good burnout - all systems are ready to go and up to temperature. I usually switch the cooling fan bypass on in the lanes on the approach so if the cool-down time has not been what it should be, the car will still be between 165-180 degrees. This appears to work even in the heat of summer.

yes I believe you are correct about there being a timer for this function "as well"..as a table referencing ECT.

If my feeble memory serves me correctly it's not a very short timer.
When I'm at the track, moving thru the lanes I turn my car off, thus resetting that timer.
When I'm in the "on deck" position my car is off until the track worker directs me to the burnout box.
I haven't "timed" my burnout and staging procedure though, so I just might be getting past the timer, or.. not.
dangit... yet.. ANOTHER way to lose
(shakes my head)
HAHA

I'm booting up the software as I'm tying this message because now you've got me curious

Time to switch to base table is 31 seconds
ECT to switch to base table is 90 degrees, not the 130 that I posted above {sorry for the incorrect data)

I'm fairly certian my ECT is above 90 degree's by the time I hit the tree..{whew}
still curious if the 31 seconds elapses from the last time I start the car, get past the 5 second ish burnout and to the tree... (hmmmm)

XLRVIII said:

When I'm at the track, moving thru the lanes I turn my car off, thus resetting that timer.
When I'm in the "on deck" position my car is off until the track worker directs me to the burnout box.

Click to expand...

XLRVIII said:

Time to switch to base table is 31 seconds
ECT to switch to base table is 90 degrees,

Click to expand...

I didn't know the time delay to switch, but I'm most likely past the timer setting when I'm at the tree. Depending upon my position in the lanes, I do the same as you but usually the car will be running when I'm on deck.

• Proceed to burnout box - 5 seconds
• Burnout - 4-5 seconds
• Stage - 5-10 seconds
• Race - say 15 seconds
• Exit - say another 15 seconds

You're probably looking at at least 30 seconds between launches. Likely 20 seconds minimum from leaving the staging lanes to get staged at the tree to launch. So if you start the car leaving the lanes to go to the burnout box, you possibly could be at the tree ready to launch before the timer switches from the cold start strategy.

Usually the track officials will not signal start the burnout until the racers ahead have crossed the 1320 foot line. That means 15-20 seconds elapse before you're at the tree and the racers ahead have had time to exit, clearing the way for the tree to start. If it only takes 5-10 seconds after you leave the lanes to start your burnout, you may very well be shaving it too close at times - but most likely enough time would've elapsed for the car to be out of cold start strategy.

I suppose me sitting there on deck with the engine running one cycle ahead, that pretty much assures I'm not starting the race in cold start strategy.

I'm going to change mine from 31, down to 20..but I'm going to put the tune in another slot and call it "race"..HAHA

The only diff between my Daily Driver tune and RACE will be this timer setting, for now.

I'm glad your around JP!

it's very productive to have another person to "bounce" this stuff off of.

Now if you only had PRP..maybe you could teach me a thing or two!

Not too many folks bracket race, so alot of the stuff out there, really doesnt help in a bracket race scenario.

Tommy on that race tune you should set the rmp to what every you launch at (1,200 rmp).
That would be cool

Stone17 said:

Tommy on that race tune you should set the rmp to what every you launch at (1,200 rmp).
That would be cool

Click to expand...

a guy I know with an odb2 vehicle has two tunes
one with regular idle speed in drive
one with his "launch" rpm in drive.

after he stages the first light he flips the switch to the "launch tune" and he doesnt have to look at his tach.

I would try something like this.. but the EEC IV cars wont "switch tunes" on the fly like obd2 will...

I dont think I want my idle rpm to be 1000RPM {my launch rpm} because it'll be "VERY CLUNKY" and "not good for the tranny" to be doing 1000 rpm neutral drops.

IF the EEC 4 would "switch tunes" without a restart... I MIGHT try this..

Actually I haven't TRIED, but I'm fairly sure the EEC IV's wont "switch on the fly"...
I might play around with this..
but I'm more concerned with getting the tune "locked in, and good to go" before I start playing with options.

good idea though, dont think for a second I haven't thought long and hard about it...

Keep in mind, what you are describing will be considered "illegal" in a "no electronics/footbrake class".

Any electronic starting line aids "delay box, trans brake, two step ect" are illegal....this type of thing would be considered a "two step rev limiter".

I've won alot of races, and wouldn't want to be accused of using an "illegal device" even though I know for a fact that some of the people we "compete against" are already doing "just that"....

I heard from the tuner that build their calibrations that this is completly true, so it's kinda cool to go out there.. and kick the crap out of these folks using "illegal starting line aids" with my FOOTBRAKE CAR.
HAHA

They were using them in the last 2006 season.. and I kicked the CRAP out of them.

Rather than "protest" them I felt it was better to "send them to the pits after round 1"..
much better than making enemies by calling them "cheaters"..
it's much better to just "send em to the pits with the yellow timeslip"
HAHA

XLRVIII said:

I would try something like this.. but the EEC IV cars wont "switch tunes" on the fly like obd2 will...
...

IF the EEC 4 would "switch tunes" without a restart... I MIGHT try this..

Actually I haven't TRIED, but I'm fairly sure the EEC IV's wont "switch on the fly"...

Click to expand...

On my 4 position SCT switch chip, I can switch on the fly EXCEPT into or out of the 'stock tune' position #4 of 0-1-2-3-4 where position 0 through position 3 are custom tunes. I can switch on the fly from 0 to 1 to 2 to 3 to 2 to 1 and back to 0 no problem.

Ahh very cool!

Thanks for the info JP

Tiff has the two position switch from her reinhart chip.. I might explore using it to switch between two tunes because it's a large rocker type switch rather than the rotary microswitch included with the 4 position chip.
Would only give me access to two tunes, but... it'd be simple enough.

still wont use this in "eliminations", but it would make my TNT/fun days alot easier/fun.