quite possibly my next ride.

jamies98lsc

Registered
its up in the air, but if things all fall in line i'll be looking at this ex FHP cruiser for my next daily driver. i'm on a cop car click lately. its a 2000 crown vic p-71 interceptor. was a real florida state trooper car, recently painted to cover the two tone black and brown, legally it cant be sold that way in this state so it was all repainted black and nicely too. tons of new stuff in it and the body and interior are not full of holes like most of these are. dont ask why i would want a cop car and not a regular crown vic, regular vic's dont do anything for me, but a blacked out p-71 i'm all over that!!

3497991249.235114570.IM1.03.565x421_A.562x421.jpg
 
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Get some blue lights behind the grille and you wont have to deal with 'sunday drivers' hogging the fast lane! Good choice! I like those... Alot! :)
 
My g/f's parents have a few grand marquis and I HATE driving them. It always feels like the back end is wagging it's tail over bumps because of the solid rear axle. One of them has such a floaty suspension it feel dangerous driving it. So I'm saying make sure you drive it a good amount before pulling the trigger on it. I'm sure the suspension is stiffer on that one you are looking at but I just wanted to warn you.

But that is one sweet looking ride, people will move over for you!
 
I had a '97 Gran Marquis as a work vehicle a few years back. It was amazing to see people slow down when I came up behind them...maybe it was all the antenna's I had. AM/FM - Phone - CB ??? But it was still a Mercury, NOT a Ford. Must have been a guilty concience.

Jamie, that car looks wicked!
 
I am a big fan of the panther cars. I am always looking out for them. I have found a few Black/Black sport models, with the floor shifter and console, instead of the column shift run-of-th-mill ones.

PI cars are hard to find out here with quality re-paints. But since Ford sells the black/black civilian version, I am holding steady.

One thing about driving a cop car is, sure it's great when people move over for you...but if there is nowhere for them to move over to...you're stuck behind them...doing the speed limit...until they exit/turn.

I drive a 12 mile stretch of road every day for a portion of my afternoon commute home...no passing....and often times I have been stuck behind someone doing exactly the speed limit....it makes a 12 mile stretch feel like a 20 minute parade route.

so keep that in mind....

the car you pictured above...is awesome.

here are a couple I have been looking at:

http://images.autotrader.com/images...6709.231736272.IM1.MAIN.565x421_A.562x421.jpg
http://images.autotrader.com/images...7431.217491198.IM1.MAIN.565x421_A.562x421.jpg


and the one I really have my eyes on...a black/black SPORT with console and floor shifter, low miles, and great price.

http://images.autotrader.com/images...2971.233799889.IM1.MAIN.565x421_A.562x421.jpg


as you know Jamie, a few months back I was seriously considering buying a Kenny Brown P1 Panther edition. It had 42k miles, silver with black leather, the KB upgrades, and it was priced VERY well. I just couldnt do a silver CV...it wasnt my color. Had it been a black one...or darkest blue..I might have gone for it. Lastly...if I ever find a low mileage Kenny Brown P2 Panther(supercharged)...I'd be on it like flies on a rib-roast.
 
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Jamie... umm NO?! You will get worse gas mileage... and that thing is a boat... You will get bored quick... Why the hell would you trade your Mark for this?! The difference in cost is like what $3000? That is if you get a beat up crown vic.

I got a 1998 Crown Vic LX that is loaded (Leather, Auto Climate control, dual power seats, better stereo, keyless entry) it is nice on the inside and is really wide... (put 3 ppl in the front) but the back seat leg room is a bit small. Had this car for the past 4 years and 100k miles... it still idles smoother than any NEW car I have been in and has a nice and soft ride and is super quiet and vibration free (as opposed to the mark) on the freeway.

That said I would NEVER EVER get an EX cop car... that is just plain dumb... they drive the crap out of them...

Just get a nice used Granny owned Crown Vic that was dealer serviced. They are pretty cheap as is. The whole P-71 is all hyped up anyways... don't give me the P-71 is so much better I wouldn't be caught dead in the civilian version crap. If you want the cop suspension the parts are super cheap and the only other difference is an oil cooler which you don't need anyways and a high output alternator. But this way you don't have to deal with an UGLY UGLY interior. And no options whatsoever.

Oh btw if you thought Mark VIIIs had terrible resale values wait till you try to sell one of these puppies.
 
dude im not trading my car for anything except money. the car is on ebay, its on auto trader, its for sale on the side of the road!! im selling it and buying something else to drive for now, the cv is cheap so im not worried about price, and i could care less about options, to me, if it runs and drives good thats all i need, i dont need options in my car so loaded up that it drives itself, we've all been spoiled the way cars are made today, power everything, tires tell you when they are low on air, headlights turn 35 dregrees around left hand corners so you can see better, give me a break, turn the key and drop it in gear. i dont need all that fancy crap, and i know what these cars drive like, i had a crown vic a few years ago as well as a grand marquis so i know what to expect. i know it isnt a mark VIII, but then again, if i cared, mine wouldnt be for sale. i want a change, i'm sick of the mark VIII's thats all i have known for the past 7 years. and as far as gas mileage i drive 2 miles a day if i am lucky, so i dont care about that either. i'm not dead set on getting a vic, i am looking at pick ups too, so it may end up being a truck who knows. just have to wait and see after i sell mine what i'll end up with.
 
Well call it what you want but you're thinking about replacing your Mark VIII with a boat... lol :D

I am just pulling your strings man seriously I love the vic... but it is a cookie cutter car... cheap to maintain and own... and super reliable... but it is not a fun car... that is for sure.

If you're looking for a large reliable sedan, I would look no further...

But looking at your Mark it seems like you would prefer something with a soul ;)
 
well with everything thats going on in my life right now, including getting tossed out of our house just before christmas, i need a car, and 4 doors would be nice with the kids right now, i dont care about fancy wheels, loud exhaust and slick looking, i can do that to another car some day down the road, right now, having something bad looking and fun is the least of my worries, sure its nice, but right now i have to many other things to think about. i'm not looking to replace my car with something equal, i know if i do this im going from one extreme to the other, and thats fine, like i said, this is temporary.
 
I TOTALLY understand where he's(Jamie) coming from.

Max, many of us "buyers" are not "consumers"/. we arent looking for the best features, image, speed, comfort, convenience, econmics, or bang for the buck EVERY SINGLE TIME we buy a car. Sometimes, we just need a decent set of wheels. Just because someone has a bad-axx hot rod doesnt mean they have no need for a full-size American car. it's one of the safest cars on the road, for the price, and of it's genre

some of have different priorities...for some, it's their cell phone plans, for others, it's the color of their bathroom tiles...and for some, it's "what gets the job WE have, done". Some of us need a car that will start, run, and not cost a bundle to keep...and the CV's do it with style, luxury, handling, safety, and affordability.

Max, when you get older, and have a family, you will understand...it isnt all about what YOU want...it's about what you NEED, and fulfills the needs of your lifestyle. which reminds me...why exactly do YOU have a crown vic?

I am a horsepower junky, I am an experienced driver both on and off the track(straight line, and around corners). I know what makes me tick...and I completely agree with Jamie....a Crown Vic is one of the best cars money can buy, hands down. The PI version is even better than a gramps version...here's why:

Peple think police cars are beat to death, all shift long. This is FALSE. Police know their car can/will save their life. it is their mount, their shield, there escape, and their means for income. The treat their issue cars better than their own. If the car should happen to get damaged during service, you can bet it gets repaired better than any car you and I will ever have the priviledge of driving. it has to...it's like their gun...if it doesnt work, they are at risk.

Have you ever seen the maintenance criteria for a Police car? it is beyond that of any factory production car.

If I were EVER to chose between an ex-police service vehicle, and one that has been owned by an individual, serviced by God knows what kind of shade-tree mechanic...you can bet I'd plop down my cash on a (ex) Police car. Not many vehicles can be idled for 1000 hours, and still withstand the duties of a 120 mph high-speed pursuit in freezing temps, or 100+ degree temps without so much as a check engine light.

Jamie...I have dealth with Towncars, grand marquis' and the likes since 1997. I would definately vote for a CV...and a P.I.C.V. even more so.

bang for the buck, cost of ownership, SAFETY, insurance, and reliability...in my opinion, there is no equal car...not within the price range of a CV.
 
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Craig...

I will respectfull disagree with you on a couple of points.

1. P-71s have NO luxury features, NONE! They are a bare bottom cars.
2. They are abused... they are idled, and their engines are NEVER turned off while on duty. Also how many 4-2 downshifts they go through on a given day. And I seriously doubt that an officer that treats the Vic like a tool will treat his car at home any worse....
3. Cost of ownership for crown vics is higher than you might think because they depreciate like mad, and getting 21mpg isn't very nice.

Yes they are nice cars, that can be picked up CHEAP used...

To answer your question, the crown vic has been in my family for some time... whenever I go somewhere when I need to drive ppl, I take it... whenver I go on a roadtrip I also take the vic.

That said it is becoming very expensive to own because of excessive fuel consumption in comparison to other cars... I average about 19mpg during normal driving and 23-24 or so during road trips. 30,000 miles a year are a lot... and I could safe a ton of money by switching to a 4 banger Accord or Camry or Civic... which is in the works for next year.

The new 07 Camry is an amazing car... it has at least as much space as the crown vic while getting 32+mpg on the freeway. And it does all that with a 4 banger... that said it is expensive... not sure what Jamies price range is... but since it sounds like he is looking for something cheap and big... I would look no further than the vic.
 
Craig...

I will respectfull disagree with you on a couple of points.

1. P-71s have NO luxury features, NONE! They are a bare bottom cars.
2. They are abused... they are idled, and their engines are NEVER turned off while on duty. Also how many 4-2 downshifts they go through on a given day. And I seriously doubt that an officer that treats the Vic like a tool will treat his car at home any worse....
3. Cost of ownership for crown vics is higher than you might think because they depreciate like mad, and getting 21mpg isn't very nice.

Yes they are nice cars, that can be picked up CHEAP used...

To answer your question, the crown vic has been in my family for some time... whenever I go somewhere when I need to drive ppl, I take it... whenver I go on a roadtrip I also take the vic.

That said it is becoming very expensive to own because of excessive fuel consumption in comparison to other cars... I average about 19mpg during normal driving and 23-24 or so during road trips. 30,000 miles a year are a lot... and I could safe a ton of money by switching to a 4 banger Accord or Camry or Civic... which is in the works for next year.

The new 07 Camry is an amazing car... it has at least as much space as the crown vic while getting 32+mpg on the freeway. And it does all that with a 4 banger... that said it is expensive... not sure what Jamies price range is... but since it sounds like he is looking for something cheap and big... I would look no further than the vic.


1)bare-bottom Ford Crown Vics(even PI's) ride better than plush Civics-especially after 100k miles

2)check the PCM programming on Ford "idle counter" equipped vehicles. Understand how the engine programming is modfied to prevent excessive wear. Not only that, but other than wasting fuel, idling a PCM-equipped fuel system vehicle is not hard on the engine. We have quite a few towncars that idle for up to 5+ hours at a stretch, sit in bumper to bumper traffic, and STILL go over 300k miles with hardly any major engine/drivetrain repairs. as for 4-2 downshifts, have you read about 4R70W's at all? Any idea what Ford did to them in 1998? Oh, and Police cars arent driven around in 4th gear, BTW.

3)by cost of ownership, I(like most) refer to the amount of money you have to SPEND while owning the car, not how much money you will lose by buying at a poor price. Once the money is spent on a car during purchase, it's spent...you cannot continue to "add" that amount when trying to deface a car's value. If you buy a car for $4000 less than advertised, would you say you made money on that car? No. You just didnt spend as much. But cost of ownership happens AFTER purchase(become an owner), so you cannot call depreciation a cost of ownership.

4)and no sane individual would compare a 2002-2005 Crown Vic PI with a 2007 Toyota Camry. That's like comparing a Mark VIII to a Lexus SC430. Apples and oranges, Maxy boy.

5)and 21 mpg aint so bad unless one plans to purchase a car for long commutes, which he has clearly said...he is not doing.

6)lastly...I refer again to the term "priorities". Just because you drive alot, and require maximum fuel economy from a car, doesnt mean any car that doesnt meet your criteria is a "poor choice".

so...how exactly do you justify purchasing a Vette, based on your listed demands of a car?
 
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well i dont want this to turn out as an opinion war, i know cop cars can be beat, specially down here in florida i see tons of these things on wreckers all the time from high speed pursuit crashes, i know cop cars get beat, i also know how to look over a car and check for things most people wouldnt have a clue to look for in a used car, i also know how to drive, so taking one for a good rip and snort down the road will let me know how it runs and how the trans reacts, im not saying i am going to jump on this one, but it is nice and its got alot of brand new parts with proof. i am with craig as far as the condition of one, these cars are constantly at the dealers, the cars have to be kept in tip top shape to even be in service, now, i wouldnt want a cop car that was in service, then sold to someone and then i buy it 4 years later, but one that just came out of service is going to be in awesome shape, everything is fixed. i am also interetsed in a white 99 that is a p71 but it was never a cop car, it belonged to the dept of agriculture so it was never hammered on, the black one i could get for 3 grand, the other white one i am looking at i can have for 2500, the black car has 144k on it the white one has 160k but the white one is in imaculate shape, after having to sell my 98 i kind of wanted to stick with black just because it would give me some kind of feeling of a cool looking car still, but i'll go with whatever color does the job. i want to stay under 4 grand, the whole point in selling my car is to have some moving money, but i also need a car too, so the less i can spend the better. this is the other one im looking at.
01010201021001160920071124d71db58b702e4dc541001aed.jpg
 
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I am not sure, but I think pre 2001 models still had conventional steering, so we're talking center link, idler arm, pitmans arm, etc...

R&P is the way to go...

I would love a PI car that was under civilian ownership, but I dont know about Florida's maintenance program, but out here...the "Law enforcement/government service" cars get better treatment than wealthy elderly folks!
 
1)bare-bottom Ford Crown Vics(even PI's) ride better than plush Civics-especially after 100k miles

2)check the PCM programming on Ford "idle counter" equipped vehicles. Understand how the engine programming is modfied to prevent excessive wear. Not only that, but other than wasting fuel, idling a PCM-equipped fuel system vehicle is not hard on the engine. We have quite a few towncars that idle for up to 5+ hours at a stretch, sit in bumper to bumper traffic, and STILL go over 300k miles with hardly any major engine/drivetrain repairs. as for 4-2 downshifts, have you read about 4R70W's at all? Any idea what Ford did to them in 1998? Oh, and Police cars arent driven around in 4th gear, BTW.

3)by cost of ownership, I(like most) refer to the amount of money you have to SPEND while owning the car, not how much money you will lose by buying at a poor price. Once the money is spent on a car during purchase, it's spent...you cannot continue to "add" that amount when trying to deface a car's value. If you buy a car for $4000 less than advertised, would you say you made money on that car? No. You just didnt spend as much. But cost of ownership happens AFTER purchase(become an owner), so you cannot call depreciation a cost of ownership.

4)and no sane individual would compare a 2002-2005 Crown Vic PI with a 2007 Toyota Camry. That's like comparing a Mark VIII to a Lexus SC430. Apples and oranges, Maxy boy.

5)and 21 mpg aint so bad unless one plans to purchase a car for long commutes, which he has clearly said...he is not doing.

6)lastly...I refer again to the term "priorities". Just because you drive alot, and require maximum fuel economy from a car, doesnt mean any car that doesnt meet your criteria is a "poor choice".

so...how exactly do you justify purchasing a Vette, based on your listed demands of a car?


To continue our debate.

1. Hum I guess so... that wasn't the point.

2. Yes I am very familiar with what was done to the trannys in 98... but you betchya it is going to cause a lot of wear and tear when you mash the throttle at 40-50mph and cause the car to downshift and skip over a gear. Once again... The only point I was trying to make was the fact that cop cars on average had a much MUCH tougher life than a regular Vic... no matter if they were dealer serviced or not.

3. This is a very wrong way to think about this Craig... and this is the primary reason so many people end up going upside down on their car loans. Depreciation may very well be the HIGHEST portion of the cost of ownership of any car... You buy a new Ford Focus and it is worth 5000 in 4 years... so you have lost 12000 on your car purchase... you buy a civic for say even 19,000 it will be worth 12,000 in 4 you have lost 7000.

So you're lost 7... even though you spent 2k more on a new civic you will have saved yourself 7k in the long run.


Jamie expressed interest in selling the car in the near future I'd think it should be taken into account obviously I was just drawing an example above... he would spend little money on the car so It wouldn't be a large factor for him.

4. Well they are both large cars?! Why not compare them...?! The camry is even cheaper new than the Crown Vic... but both start around the same price range... both are cookie cutter cars and both are relatively safe.

5. Gasoline purchases are part of ownership costs just like depreciation... i'd like to think that if someone buys a car they'd drive it a sufficient amount. In Jamie's case yes he mentioned short distances... so this may not be a good factor. That said I am really not trying to turn this into an argument of what is better... in Jamies case there are really almost NO choices out there... if he doesn't drive much he should get the Crown Vic... I was just suggesting to get the civilian version for my above mentioned reasons which apparently sparked a lengthy debate.

6. This has nothing to do with the Vette if you'd like we can have a separate discussion about that... There were a TON of factors that went into the purchase of that car. ;)
 
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well i dont want this to turn out as an opinion war, i know cop cars can be beat, specially down here in florida i see tons of these things on wreckers all the time from high speed pursuit crashes, i know cop cars get beat, i also know how to look over a car and check for things most people wouldnt have a clue to look for in a used car, i also know how to drive, so taking one for a good rip and snort down the road will let me know how it runs and how the trans reacts, im not saying i am going to jump on this one, but it is nice and its got alot of brand new parts with proof. i am with craig as far as the condition of one, these cars are constantly at the dealers, the cars have to be kept in tip top shape to even be in service, now, i wouldnt want a cop car that was in service, then sold to someone and then i buy it 4 years later, but one that just came out of service is going to be in awesome shape, everything is fixed. i am also interetsed in a white 99 that is a p71 but it was never a cop car, it belonged to the dept of agriculture so it was never hammered on, the black one i could get for 3 grand, the other white one i am looking at i can have for 2500, the black car has 144k on it the white one has 160k but the white one is in imaculate shape, after having to sell my 98 i kind of wanted to stick with black just because it would give me some kind of feeling of a cool looking car still, but i'll go with whatever color does the job. i want to stay under 4 grand, the whole point in selling my car is to have some moving money, but i also need a car too, so the less i can spend the better. this is the other one im looking at.
01010201021001160920071124d71db58b702e4dc541001aed.jpg

That sounds like a more or less decent deal Jamie.
I'd shop around a bit more before pulling the trigger though.

In my area here are the ones that I found...

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/car/497620395.html 02 with 170k for 3k
http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/car/496536007.html 99 with 104k for 2800
 
Well call it what you want but you're thinking about replacing your Mark VIII with a boat... lol :D

I am just pulling your strings man seriously I love the vic... but it is a cookie cutter car... cheap to maintain and own... and super reliable... but it is not a fun car... that is for sure.

If you're looking for a large reliable sedan, I would look no further...

But looking at your Mark it seems like you would prefer something with a soul ;)



I agree 100%

I've had my 98 marquis for 50k and couldn't pick a better car as a daily driver. It idels soooo smooth and shifts the same way even at 107,000 miles. It was well maintaned with the first owner and i've kept it up. Thats why i couldn't imagine selling it when i picked up my 97 lsc 2 months ago. They will last easily 150k+ on stock trans and 200+ on motor....

The thing i would watch out for if you get a northern car is the rust above all the rockers. All of Mine have started to bubble in the last year. The under carrige looks goo though. Nothing like my lincoln thats only 1 year older :(. I cant think of anything in the interior thats a concern off hand. O' Cracked driver/pass door panels..Though thats an easy fix w/ some abs compound, mines holding after a year.

Reguardless, if you want a boaty (unless pi) comfy, reliable, not the greatest on gas car that'll last till your kids go to college pick up a vic/ marquis.
 
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